Could it be that the book of revelations was simply written in apocrypha like a coded language at the time so the romans would not understand its content? Bart Ehrmans argument was that regarding the number of the beast 666, at the time numerology was common and that this number gives the word neron ceasar or nron ksr in aramaic. So would it be more correct to say that this book is not of revelations to come but of that time as a anti-roman literature?
Joey Jo-Jo
JoinedPosts by Joey Jo-Jo
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33
Who Wrote the Book of Revelation, and when?
by ProdigalSon inmy money is on sybil of cumae, in the 6th century bc.
not a co-incidence that pythagoras and many other enlightened ones came along at this time.
it comes in periodic waves from the center of the milky way..... despite the bible saying that fortune tellers are forbidden, michelangelo was allowed to paint this very well known fortune-teller in the sistine chapel.
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Logical Questions to Make Them Think?
by sweet pea inthis has no doubt been covered before and if anyone has any favourite threads on this subject perhaps they could post them here .
what are your best one liners/questions to make jw's think?.
i had a heated conversation with my mum this weekend and apart from mainly going round in circles (as is often the case with brainwashed cult members) one thing made her stop and i could see that she was having major trouble processing the logic.
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Joey Jo-Jo
As black sheep points out stay on one topic, they think they have the truth so they wont think much of the conversation if you keep touching on a lot of subjects. Take e.g. disfellowshiping as a topic, do your research first then ask them what qualifies a person to be shunned and were in scripture is it, make sure the person your talking to is very confortable speaking to you, im guilty on getting too animated in the past that i made things worse. Try not to speak of something that you have to teach them like blood, they dont like to be teached, let the bible stumble them.
This is just from my experience and everyone is different, goodluck.
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What is the most offensive/idiotic piece of WT literature you've read from the past 20 years (approximately)?
by Chemical Emotions ini think that some of the dumbest were ones that pertained to science- not all of them, but a few, particularly the ones about evolution.
the most offensive (and also dumbest) were the ones about women, and the ones about rape.
those were horrible.
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Joey Jo-Jo
from jwfacts youtube vid masterbation can turn you gay lol
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If Jehovah Wanted Only "One Flesh" For "Mates" Why Did He Sanction The Having Of Man Wives & Concubines?
by minimus inaccording to the bible, king solomon was blessed by jehovah with riches, wisdom and women---lots of them!.
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Joey Jo-Jo
Apparently the torah and most of the books from the old testament were addressed to the Jewish community ONLY, not for the gentiles at all.
The NT completly disregards this fact, starting from the oldest book of the NT Mark gentiles were not bound by the laws of the torah like circumcision.
Eventually the newer the NT texts the more anti-jew they become, Paul calling them the sons of the devil yet in Mark 15:2 Jesus said to Pilate that he was king of the Jews.
To this day christians continue to speak of the OT and new covenant and jesus being a christian speaking aramaic while the facts show Jesus not to be the messiah of the OT, OT was not an open letter to gentiles and Jesus was a jewish speaking hebrew.
Marcion was right all along, the god of the NT is not the god of the OT.
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Growing up a Jehovah's Witness - New Video
by jwfacts ini have put together a video - growing up a jehovah's witness 1960 -2010. it aims to show the things a witnesses would be taught as they age over those decades.
it is 15 minutes long.
this is my first attempt at a video and it took a while to work out how to use final cut, so please feel free to make suggestions if anything should be changed.
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Joey Jo-Jo
I like it, simple, effective, straight to the point, does not offende anyones intelligence.
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Running into a brick wall- conversations without logic
by Joey Jo-Jo ini had this experience with a family member, lets say you say something against the witnesses doctronic and they dont say anything back, you ask them why are you not replying and they say "well you dont believe in us anymore".. what should i say back, something that wont offend them but goes straight to the point, you see they dont want to use their brains, they just want to listen at their halls about the end and apostates and how special they are and how false the rest of the world is and how they are the only true religion that follow the commandment to preach.
but it does not matter what i say, doesn't matter how big it is it seems to have the reverse effect, it was alot easier before but now a conversation comes which they dont like they shun my conversation, yet they show me love, they dont touch whats the big issue, the big problem which is communication, and they maybe expected me to wake up, go back to the hall like nothing ever happen, like preaching is only for people who like what they hear.
im babling on but you get the idea.. .
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Joey Jo-Jo
A lot of good points, are steven hassans books available on pdf form and how much are they?
simon17: If you mean by converting to showing them that they are a false religion then yeah, if you know something is wrong isn't it normal to worn the other person? But jw's know better than using logic or common sense, now I can speak from a christian or agnostic perspective, I can say that jesus is the way an not a organization or I could say that jesus made a lot of references to the book of the dead, they believe in the bible therefore its more effective to use the bible as my sword.
This isn't just about converting, you and I know this religion is bull and its not going to last, and from whats going on watchtowers and conventions I dont like were this is going, I think the virgen old farts know this and are doing their best to make a quick buck, but at the cost of shunning others and in the future "spiritually weak" jw's, people have died for this religion from their teachings, what we dont need now is another jonestown, you get the idea.
Tuesday there was an earthquake in melbourne, at the dinner table they asked me if i knew about the quake, i said yes and then they said about being prepared blabla (for a normal earthquake), they aspect me to wake up like they were right all along, that they are the only religion that speaks of these things as sign that the end is near and that they are right, but they say these things without actually saying it, its like incoded language, thats what bugs me, if this really was the true religion than what is the big deal in actually speaking, communicating like normal human beings? Let me read this franz book and ill tell you whats wrong with it, no this never happens and there is not a scripture that supports their idea of shunning information because its a cult and with all cults they dig themselves deeper and deeper underground.
ambersun: thats right they dont understand but they dont want to understand, but as you say it could be worse
black Sheep and mad sweeney: I had tried that in the past and it works but they know my agenda, my fault.
Quandry: thx I have it easy, I could only imagen what it would be if I was bathtised, my faded cousin is doing worse and he's not even an apostate, being shun by his dumb sisters and parents.
Giordano: sorry to hear
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Running into a brick wall- conversations without logic
by Joey Jo-Jo ini had this experience with a family member, lets say you say something against the witnesses doctronic and they dont say anything back, you ask them why are you not replying and they say "well you dont believe in us anymore".. what should i say back, something that wont offend them but goes straight to the point, you see they dont want to use their brains, they just want to listen at their halls about the end and apostates and how special they are and how false the rest of the world is and how they are the only true religion that follow the commandment to preach.
but it does not matter what i say, doesn't matter how big it is it seems to have the reverse effect, it was alot easier before but now a conversation comes which they dont like they shun my conversation, yet they show me love, they dont touch whats the big issue, the big problem which is communication, and they maybe expected me to wake up, go back to the hall like nothing ever happen, like preaching is only for people who like what they hear.
im babling on but you get the idea.. .
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Joey Jo-Jo
Soeey, what I meant was they are saying "offcourse we dont want to talk about it, you no longer believe in the truth"
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Running into a brick wall- conversations without logic
by Joey Jo-Jo ini had this experience with a family member, lets say you say something against the witnesses doctronic and they dont say anything back, you ask them why are you not replying and they say "well you dont believe in us anymore".. what should i say back, something that wont offend them but goes straight to the point, you see they dont want to use their brains, they just want to listen at their halls about the end and apostates and how special they are and how false the rest of the world is and how they are the only true religion that follow the commandment to preach.
but it does not matter what i say, doesn't matter how big it is it seems to have the reverse effect, it was alot easier before but now a conversation comes which they dont like they shun my conversation, yet they show me love, they dont touch whats the big issue, the big problem which is communication, and they maybe expected me to wake up, go back to the hall like nothing ever happen, like preaching is only for people who like what they hear.
im babling on but you get the idea.. .
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Joey Jo-Jo
I had this experience with a family member, lets say you say something against the witnesses doctronic and they dont say anything back, you ask them why are you not replying and they say "well you dont believe in us anymore".
What should I say back, something that wont offend them but goes straight to the point, you see they dont want to use their brains, they just want to listen at their halls about the end and apostates and how special they are and how false the rest of the world is and how they are the only true religion that follow the commandment to preach. But it does not matter what I say, doesn't matter how big it is it seems to have the reverse effect, it was alot easier before but now a conversation comes which they dont like they shun my conversation, yet they show me love, they dont touch whats the big issue, the big problem which is communication, and they maybe expected me to wake up, go back to the hall like nothing ever happen, like preaching is only for people who like what they hear. Im babling on but you get the idea.
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Can angels flap their wings
by Joey Jo-Jo inwhere did this idea that angels came from the sky flapping their wings?
were in the bible does it say that angels had wings?
aren't angels just messangers?.
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Joey Jo-Jo
No serious lol, good point Knowsnothing, but cherubs spoken in ezekiel and rev refer to angels?
zidina: what im trying to understand is that in the first five books the word angel or messanger did not refer to a celestial being.
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Can angels flap their wings
by Joey Jo-Jo inwhere did this idea that angels came from the sky flapping their wings?
were in the bible does it say that angels had wings?
aren't angels just messangers?.
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Joey Jo-Jo
Where did this idea that angels came from the sky flapping their wings? Were in the bible does it say that angels had wings? aren't angels just messangers?